Bad Grammar Parody Video
Here is a video JamesatWar made featuring yours truly which is a parody of “The way I are” video, called “Bad Grammar”.
Tell me what you think 
Marina
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Posted on May 16, 2008 · Filed Under News, Shout Outs
Geez this is better than the original. Really though
A good video about grammar in songs.
But I am confused at why learning “grammar “is an issue in the United States.
How can you put a coherent sentence together if you don’t know
the basic rules?
You don’t learn English via osmosis.You learn and practice it. In reading, writing and conversation.
But it seems to be an issue at universities, where arts, languages etc are under funded, also known as “under paid”.
This comment actually belongs to the “Funny old video” posted by Miss M.
BUT… I do believe that there are certain rules that need to be followed in grammar… otherwise, what’s the point of even teaching grammar (or language for that matter) in school? I almost feel that this attack on the idea of “good grammar” is almost an attack on eduction as a whole.
I feel that grammar rules allow children to be taught the structure of their language.. and if you standardize these rules, you can teach everyone in a particular language to be able to communicate with each other. If you do away with standardization, I feel that you actually run the risk of creating GREATER segregation, as different groups will sound totally different and may even have trouble communicating with each other… which is the exact opposite effect that those opposed to the idea off “bad grammar” want to see happen.
Definitely a controversial topic that I didn’t realize was as controversial until this video came out
I totally agree.
I also worry, that if students are not taught grammar they will consider English to be a difficult subject to be avoided, rather than enjoyed.
I hope you enjoy making the videos as much as we enjoy watching them.
All the best.
KB
Sorry for such a late post, fantastic video, better than the original. As for the comments regarding bad grammar spoken by certain ethnic groups, well I guess it depends on your perspective. Since I am in the ethnic sub-group of all people that speak/or are deaf,sign language, I recommend tolerance to all. We all started someplace, are going to someplace, want to get there, so we need help for direction (except if we are males, then we never ask for directions).
I love it Marina!
I listen to it all the time, I even ripped it to my iPod
When I am in a bad mod, I go watch one of your videos and always makes me feel much better. Thanks for making all thise vids Marina, means alot for me.
cool as sh*t
Hi Marina!
I hope you like this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qj5qgfQj-co
Funny. I couldn’t get Marinas’ vid to run this AM (flagged). Had to watch yours a couple of times before I heard what you were saying, so that makes it so much like a typical HFW vid.
Those aren’t real … the hair extensions I mean. 
The tat? Gave you 5* & subbed for now, you look like fun to watch.
Watched a couple your others vids & yes the price of oil affects me dearly. Every time the price of oil & subsiquently fuel goes up, my shops’ business declines for a while… the last price increase kicked us for more than a week. But eventually ppl. just bite the bullet & get back in their cars & drive everywhere again. Interesting guy to watch ZeroFossilFuel Cheers, sosaut
Marina - I had the same issue this morning, but I don’t think it had anything to do with Youtube flagging. Normally, if Youtube flags, i just click on the “confirm birthdate” button and it plays. But this morning, for some reason on your site and on youtube the video would start and then freeze. Later, it played fine.
I think those youtube people flagging your videos as 18+ are ridiculous. I mean, I’m all for being mindful of common decency and all, but your videos are tame - at most, flirty. There is so much more on youtube that goes unflagged that is actually what the average person might consider “dirty” that it has to be that you’ve gotten on some group’s radar. I would bet it’s a single person or group of people from the same organization flagging your videos. Is it possible to find out who, specifically, is flagging your videos and point out to youtube that it’s the same person every time?
I was unaware of Peak Oil.. very informative. I think they need to come up with a better name for that though.. as I thought you were talking about a body oil. Peak Oil doesn’t conjure up an image of something depleting. But those are just my initial thoughts.
Hi Marina,thanks for the response. My home office computer decides on it’s own which videos I can watch & when LOL. Your vid just wouldn’t start up today but kriscans’ did, but as soon as I got to work, first order of business was watch yourvid. although still flagged it worked flawlessly.
I voted for the 7milliondollarman quite a few times today on all my computers, he’s getting close to #1. You’re such a sweetheart, for providing the link. thanks.
Does the digg thing mean anything to your site, just wondering,I hitt the digg thing but there is an eery echo in there, just ask & I’m sure it would do better for you.
Actually kirscan soundslike an interesting girl, can’t be all bad she dances in some of her vids. She seems to be sincerely into stirring up thought& awareness with infotainment. She obviously studdied you pretty good to imittate that well.
I, i love this video, i simply can stop watch it…,
I’m portuguese, sorry for my bad english
can anyone make the lyric of this video?
thankx
bye
Marina,
Do you want me to get this song played in dance halls all over the UK ? Must be good publicity.
I circulate music to DJs and the main annual event for Europe is on Friday 31st May to Monday 67 hours non stop dancing.
I reckon I can get it played there.
Is the song available to email as a MP3 music file that I can write to CD ?
Just wanted to know that despite me not having the mp3 file, a DJ found and obtained it independently and played it on Sunday afternoon.
So your song has been played in the most prestigious Ceroc style/Modern Jive event in Europe and flew straight into the most elite section of the event , the blues room frequented by world champions.
Tell me about it.
I was in his pocket and I got very dizzy. 58 hours dancing
Marina and JamesatWar,
I just wanted to say that was fantastic. Clever, well produced and funnny! I’d be happy to watch any other ‘duets’ the two of you (y’all?) might produce. Well done!
kirk2112
That was hilarious! Please keep access to that vid so I can b playin it wen I wants.
P.S. I can not play the answer to the penthouse game.
Kisses,
I love Jamesatwar’s Hey Harry Potter song. Check it out.
Well, it’s June. Class finishes for the year soon. And the teachers are just laying assignment after assignment on us. I just don’t have the time to surf the Net that much anymore. And plus I have summer school….
I didn’t think anything was better than Fernando and Thomas’ McDonalds rap. This takes genius to a whole new level.
GJ
Fantastic…JamesatWar must have had an afflatus prior to writing this song. For too long the excerebrose, oligophrenial, quisquilian, rebarbative, thersitical zoophytes who comprise much of the music industry have been rewarded for their ignorance. (Check out those words Marina.)
More people should see this thing.
Yeah! I am STILL a little
“green” with envy over
your sucess as the TA.
That scene was hot!
It’s been a couple weeks,
I know, but I have a vivid
memory. Congratulations!
Hey super cool video.
I love the lyrics dude.
Привет другу джеймсу из россии.
целую, солнце везде!
Marina,
You and James should do the music video “Promiscuous” by Nellie Fertado.
Marina,
This video is great. You should do more music videos.
Very good job!
The music, the words that fits with the original, all very very good!
QUESTION:
Is it “Cut the MUSTER” OR “Cut the MUSTARD?”
and what is the origin?
LOL Needless to say, Marina is the highlight of this video.
I prefer the works of Noam Chomsky and the psychological power of GOOD grammar, as that’s what our brains are wired to. Perhaps that is why we react so negatively to bad grammar.
Ebonics.
An immigrant comes to America and has two jobs and studies
a second language. Bad grammar people have false pride and
badly learn a language that only they can understand. Yet they
act so proud! Convoluded. Hot for words will help them!
if only they will help themselves. thanks for helping me Marina.
Your moves are strong.
I could just listen to Marina’s music from Ronald Jenkins for hours.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=smE-uIljiGo&eurl=ht tp://www.hotforwords.com/music/
Bad grammar in video games: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdtzZ10TMjw “All your base are belong to us”
Bad grammar in music….lol…. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7DjP0a5Iu0
Quality Miss, that hits the nail on the head.
Top marks for the mini kilt, from Scotland
Marina,
I thought the BAD GRAMMER vid was out of sight
Quoting “the way I are” aren’t you spposed to use foot notes stating where the quote was found.
If it were you stating it then you wouldn’t need them cause that is your phrase used as part of your statement.
Where the title in quotes might be corrrect for the phrase bad grammer has the answer right there with the band used name for the reference.
Greg
AWSON!!!
totelly! great video, nice dancin’, lovely piercing!
Hello my dear teacher.
That video rocks!
Since I´m swede my knowledge of english or american grammar isn´t the best and I guess there are some difference between UK and US when it comes to grammar also….
Saying that, you might consider letting me stay after the school also?!?!
from your dera student / Swedehunter
What is racist about this parody?
I agree
you’re definitely right there 2hotforwordsfanclub. The parody version is way better in my opinion.
I have just seen the original Timberland version and your video comparatively kicks ass to explosive proportions.!
The music quality, tittilation factor , humour, Sheena’s harmonies and entertainment factor and the pimped up school bus was so superior to the bland music and lyrics of Timberland.
See if you agree
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_-1peCW6Ok
I agree, the parody video is way better than the original.
The lyrics are brilliant, and the clever “after the school” at the end.
Do you agree with me that after the school is incorrect ?
I Agree, “after the school” is incorrect grammar.
hey is good,it’s so funy
Hey MARINA
I just realised that ‘You are staying after the school’ is bad grammar in itself.. Sorry Marina but it is. (I can detect the slight aroma of a deliberate mistake reasoning coming.)
‘The school’ is undeniably a physical object which cannot be stood behind in this sense yet the solitude school word is referring to an abbreviation for ’school time’ .or ’school period’.
Therefore the correct grammar is ‘You are staying after school’ or to be more perfect ‘you are staying after school time’ as teachers in UK said to me.
This guy might have some weird ideas but I reckon he is right doll
I say ‘YOU ARE STAYING AFTER SCHOOL’
Tiger are you a male or female hampster. I have a little hamster named Hammie that might want to meet you.
What do you think this is a bloody Russian Brides website for hamsters ?
No actually Capman911, Markie (2HFWFC) told me that there is an old ancient proverb.
Except for Marina no decent female can send a good e-male.
They were a bit sexist in those days.
My problem is this 1970s song could have been about me.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CprQ295dxVw
So basically if Hammy is male not a good idea,
If Hammie is female best way to lose your hamster.
THE ABOVE VIDEO REALLY IS A HOOT
click……..Roger female Hamster Bonking Willgo there Over……..click
Man I laughed so hard at that video. It was great Tiger.
So I take it that you don’t want a dog eating homophobic hamstressiser friend for Hammie then Eh?
great video, tiger!
Thanks Wurtle Tax
What is a Wurtle and why are the Revenue involved here ?
On my planet we say ‘Staying at school after you are’
Hey 2hot, just wondering where your ringing in from…if ya dont mind
You know the answer to that one already. North of England.
Man what happened here?
I leave for about 2 hours to go to a county commisioners meeting and lord the chatter is grown enormous.
I think I am going to bed so I don’t get caught up in how I sound being from the deep south.
LMFAO
it’s HILARIOUS
When did it become racist to laugh at something that is funny? If someone sounds like a fool, maybe they are, in fact, a fool. Being foolish has never been, is not currently, and will never be dependent on skin color. The color of someone’s skin should never, under any circumstances, make them immune to the mocking and ridicule they so richly deserve. Everyone needs to lighten up on being so sensitive about skin color and worrying if something is offensive. Who cares? Grow some thicker skin and get a life. Most importantly, laugh at what’s funny.
I loved it. It may be racist, but also accurate in pointing out the lack of verbal skills of the Hip Hop Nation. You don’t have to be black to be part of that Nation. I hear, white, brown and Oriental kids all use that type of language. It’s their Nation, no mine. If that’s how they communicate, then let them be.
That Ruled!!!! Very Hot Marina.
Oka, Marina -
I found this video slightly humorous but it borders on being racist since it is obviously geared towards hiphop culture and, ergo, black kids. It would have been better had the video been made by a person of color and not a white guy talking as if he was black. Anyway, I enjoy you and your work.
Sweet video!
Go Green!
Go with Velocity!
Awesome.
warmly,
Nelson
More Bad Grammar PLZ. That`s great.
Превосходно. 
A linguistics professor was lecturing to his class one day. “In English,” he
said, “A double negative forms a positive. In some languages, though, such
as Russian, a double negative is still a negative. However, there is no language wherein a double positive can form a negative.”
A voice from the back of the room piped up, “Yeah, right.”
Sweeping generalizations are always wrong.
(Including that one)
Is there such a thing as Bad Grammar?
oops… http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Bad_grammar
oh, come on, this is getting ridiculous.
That was supposed to be funny.
Sorry proz but If you consider a pork barbeque at a Bar Mitsva to be funny then that article was hilarious.
Actually, 2hotforwordsfanclub, I do consider a the idea of a pork barbeque at a bar mitsva to be rather funny.
Kind of like a McDonald’s in Calcutta…..a reading of Orwell’s Animal Farm in a Mosque… 
God Hates Ham
Interesting video
Seems mad that as the most intelligent species that walked this planet we will probably be the shortest lived due to our stupidity from our inability to cohabit with one another mainly because we have to force our religious point of view on others.
Hows it ham-ging Pros ?
Still lassooing the girlies ?
Who says God doesn’t like me
He doesn’t like ham ? Sters me up that does.
Listen baby guurl.. your on to something here.. more more
key? don’t make us wait to long.. waiting sux 
Maybe the next teachers pet.. will be none-other than… MOI 
Kisses!:*
P.S You have a lovely singing voice.. I never would have guessed it
But, you do! :*
Thanks for the information.
Information .. hm that’s an interesting word isn’t it?
I wonder, what would be it’s etymology? Do you think you can help me out on this one?
More kisses! :*:*
funny like hell
and i like the music btw
Wow!!! That was so good words fail!
Oh by the great sun God of Alitar
THAT VIDEO WAS OUT OF THIS WORLD
I see well-thought-out arguments are unwelcome to you here, buzzword. As I have no other way to contact you, mind telling me why my comment was unwelcome and deleted?
Others, apologies. A well-reasoned argument was deleted and I just want to know why, that’s all.
cause it sucked. big time.
You don’t even know what it was… thanks.
Maybe the comment was abducted by aliens
Total apology to all. I was acting retarded and did not see the post in the list. Again, I screwed up, sorry.
that’s cool, now… let’s get ready to rumble!
I thought it was great! Look at the pic next buzz. I know-I know, they say dont judge a book by its cover. I say you can get a pretty good of it just by reading the back.
huh? you want to take a look at his ass or something?
I ment, by reading the back of the book!!….but that WAS funny. good one aLx
Are you trying to start something. I’ll take you and your fairy godmother out before you can say salagadoola mechicka boola bibbidi bobbidi boo! Don’t mess with my simian punk ass.
har har… I had to look up the words to that song.
Hey, check out the pimped out short bus!
Is that a Double Dutch Bus ,Marina?
Damn, girl! Fo’ shizzle. You straight up on da’ low downs, earnin’ street cred, fo rizzle!
All I can say is WOW
Ummm…. thoughts please?
check out ali g. “does you think …?”
This one is my favourite.
Maybe i am biased because I used to chat to him every time I saw him in Marks And Spencer Handforth Dean..
Ali G has me howling with laughter at the abuse he gives both of the Beckhams. I can’t believe Ali G wasn’t knocked out !
It is Comic Relief an entire night of collecting charity money for third world countries ……
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P842Tmi6lrc
Would english teachers ever be able to give out report cards? maybe not, my son writes very well & my wife & I think he is gifted that way (Hope he keeps it up) but his english teacher murdered him on his interpretation of some poetry they had to study. He didn’t see it her way. She really missed the boat as it were & I only hope she didn’t discourage him. Good Writers make you think but I don’t think the best ones are trying to make you think their way only… just think…
King Solomon Wrote ” A wise son makes a glad father” I don’t know what thats called when it has two meanings like that, ie. is he making his father glad or is he going to be a glad father? both are true
plus, I’ve said that many times before: there’s no such thing as bad grammar. this is just wrong.
“are” is an _inflected_ form of “be”. that means, feature checking _does_ take place when generating a phrase like “I are”. it’s not “I be”, although this phrase is found, too (”I be good.”), as well as using only non-inflected forms in, as I understand it, sentences of non-imperfect tense. there are also cases of just dropping the copula (”he no good.”).
oh, yeah. as buzzword mentioned, I was talking about vernacular.
Talking about Grammar that is bad we are ?
How about sentence construction whilst we are on the subject.
Yoda of Star Wars
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=qovKnS3rG0A
Is there anyone out there know any better example ?
I ain’t talken shit when givin’ nods to african american vernacular english. I mean, dude may be sayin’ it all polite and all, but he right! Truth. Don’ nobody say nothin after that. ain’t nothin’ left to be said. <a
haref=”http://www.une.edu.au/langnet/definitions/a ave.html”Understand?
shit! that was an important link… Understand?
You should look up the words to “dope man” NWA…after I heard that one there was nothin’ to listen to ’cause I heard it all.at least back in 85-86
Nowhere else to stick this. Hosers eh! http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=C_TfBbR6L0M We say on the west coast that the east coast canadians are hard to understand & we even have newfie jokes but they get horny too http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=ySiE34Stt3E. I wanted to post this lower in the thread but couldn’t hit the reply,
I worked with some swiss guys who spoke german but in such a way that German customers of ours could only make out a few words. So I’m sure english is not still the only language to divide people.
HUH? I’m not a wizard over here but I DO know that you can drive through any “hood” with a vidoeo camera(if you live) and have enough footage to make the movie “Decline of Western Civilisation part III”…BTW, part 1 was about punk rock & part 2 was about heavy metal. I liked part 1 the best because it was MY time…both pretty good though
I’ve been held at gun point on the south side of chicago but the decline of western civilization as you stated is actually occurring in our nations capitol, ditch the camera and watch some c-span. The shit happening in the hood is because of <a
href=”http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b41sR6dJ8AE”< western civilization. punk as fuck.
fuck, <a
href=”http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b41sR6dJ8AE”< western civilization.
fuckity fuck!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b41sR6dJ8AE
1st -c-span is just a bunch rubbish and poppycock and it makes my blood boil to even think about watching it. 2nd- The reason I brought up those movies is because they discuss the impact of music on a genaration of kids of that particular era. 3rd- Dont get me wrong, I listened to DK, The Circle jerks. GBH, ST, The Sex Pistols,Black Flag, and still do at times. But when I was about 17yrs old I realized that they were mostly whining about how life is’nt fair and if I went along with what they were preaching I’d just be another jerkoff waiting for my welfare check to come in. The point is, I cant stand people who complain about life not being fair when more times than not its the desisions they’ve made throughout thier lives that puts them in the posistion they’re now.
that’s cool, but you got to recognize the impact that other people’s decisions make on other people. Lot’s of people in the hood don’t have that many choices left to them. That is due in part to the decisions of those with more authority and responsibility. Chicago’s south side and LA’s south central are excellent examples.
Right on bro!
“cause the boys in the hood are always hard, come talkin’ that trash -we’ll pull ya card”…NWA was the greatest ever when it comes to rap…hands down, the were the OG’s fo sho
Afropo, I just remembered this from back in the day, Funkin Lessons, kickin’ it back to you old school style. Get it, “afropo”, “apropo”. This is some funny shit I tell you.
I got it, I like it, I want some more of it.
http://www.hotforwords.com
I believe this is the link that Buzzword was pointing us to.
It says there that “African American Vernacular English in the USA” is “called a minority dialect”; isn’t this the root of the problem that manifested itself as the neglect of the “Rural Southern Black” children in the schools they attended in the “prosperous, mostly white suburb” to which they had moved?
Labelling their language as a “minority dialect” attached a stigma to them which prevented their teachers from recognizing their duty to apply to the students their human rights.
I suggest that if the students’ language had been regarded as a Creole or a Pidgin, they might have received more equitable attention from their teachers who, in my opinion, were guilty of, at best, criminal neglect of their duty towards those students.
I have written elsewhere on this web site that, if one expects to fit in to a society one has to play by the rules of that society; but equally, it is almost impossible to do that if the society,in its turn, does not make an equal effort to accept and welcome the incomers and actively help them to learn the rules, culture and language which it uses.
This is not to suggest that the incomers should abandon their previous customs altogether; merely that they need to learn additional skills to interact with their new neighbours.
That’s nice if you want to fit in, I don’t.
Nice for you, Buzz. I wish you well.
cool. peace out.
By that logic, any modified form of English, such as “I ain’t got none” or “I seen that” is not “wrong.”
Well, there is nothing “wrong” with it (in terms of being morally wrong). However, before bad grammar becomes good grammar it has to, in my opinion, create a new structure (and not be merely a mixed slang without any coherence).
So, somebody else’s “new” structure only becomes acceptable if it meets your existing criteria for grammar. Your argument seems a little elitist. But hey, I don’t expect you to change to meet my expectations.
what is a “new structure”?
Anything that makes you feel insecure.
Wow, buzzword - no need to make this personal by calling me names.
Let me ask you this: Are English textbooks defining English grammar rules “elitist,” and are books like Strunk & White’s Elements of Style “elitist.” I’ve never claimed that anyone needs to meet “my standards” or that I set any standards. However, that does not change the fact that there are and always have been standards.
Anyway, had you read my post of 2:28 below, you would see that I am not claiming to be “the” authority on English. Nor have I claimed that English rules never change. I’ve never suggested that language is mathematics, or carved in stone. Quite the opposite.
Where the line is drawn is a never ending debate. The fact that language is to some extent fluid (and can and will change) does not, however, mean that “anything goes” and that slang and non-standard English is equal (in my opinion, that is - you are free to hold that everything is equal and that all grammar rules are arbitrary and elitist - but, I suspect that the consensus will fall on my side).
Is it not possible for one to acknowledge that there are rules without claiming that there can be no change? If one acknowledges that “ain’t got none” and “less people” are incorrect, is he or she to be smeared as an elitist?
P.S. Your post implies that I’ve expressed some “elitist” views. I don’t think that’s fair to say about me, but it goes without saying that you are free to hold whatever view you like. I will point out that the only time I have ever taken a stance that could have been considered denigrating to another person was with respect to a person who went by the handle “errinf” when he made some vicious threats against our trusty teacher. Other than that, I’ve respected (and respect) everyone here, including you. Peace.
dude, I said your argument seems elitist. I wouldn’t call you an elitist. If I implied as much a apologize. If I thought you were an elitist I would say that and say fuck and variations of fuck a lot to add emphasis. The only rule of language is that it must convey meaning. But that really isn’t a rule as much as a law of successful communication. Somebody else may use language that contradicts your rules, as long as they are able to communicate between each other what universal rules have been broken. Their language and grammar does not invalidate yours. I understand the meaning conveyed by I ain’t got none so it is following the rules that guide successful communication.
buzzword - you said you didn’t expect me to change (apparently, from being elitist). But, whatever, it doesn’t matter.
aLx - in terms of language, “structure” means, “the pattern of organization of a language as a whole, or of arrangements of linguistic units, as phonemes, morphemes or tagmemes, within larger units.”
Thus, a “new” structure, would be “a of a kind now existing or appearing for the first time; novel.”
…oops…. “of a kind now existing or appearing for the first time; novel,” not “a of a kind…”
“I ain’t got none” and “I seen that” have a certain kind of structure. and? I don’t really see your point. I wasn’t interested in a definition per se anyway, I know what a structure is. I just wanted to know what you meant by “create a new structure” in that context. what kind of structure are you thinking about?
The point is that there is a difference between getting making an error and using a new grammatical construction that makes sense as part of the whole system.
For example, we correct people when they say “Tom and me went to the store.” Why? Well, the correct grammar is “Tom and I went to the store.” So, why isn’t “Tom and me…” just as “correct?” On what basis does anyone claim that “Tom and me…” is not just as legitimate in that example? My answer is that the language has not changed, yet, to a degree where the grammatical construction “Tom and me…” makes any sense at all in the overall system. However, the paradigm can and most likely will change over time.
My overall point is that language is free to, and does, change over time (witness the dramatic changes in the English language over the last several centuries alone). On the other hand, by convention, usage, custom, etc., the English language does, in fact, have structure. There are rules. We are not wrong in correcting grammar school children that proper English (right now) uses “Tom and I…” and not “Tom and me…”
Often, of course, the rules are hotly debated, some more than others. Also, rules change. If and when they change is hard to say. There is no officiating body that makes a determination. It’s impossible to say, for example, exactly when late middle English changed into early modern English. It did, however, change.
Does anyone deny that there are grammatical rules that apply to the English language as used presently? If there are no grammatical rules, then there is no grammar at all. It’s “anything goes.” Is anyone here advocating that position?
strike “getting making” from the first sentence above.
OK, further clarification, because it does matter, for successful communication. I meant you don’t have to change your opinion, not you. I said your argument seems elitist, not you. I meant with a degree of ribbing that you expect people to change to meet your expectations. Whereas I don’t. I see now that I provided substantial material for confusion in just a few sentences. I’m just that damned good. That being said I think your still wrong, and I’d rather finish this discussion in a pub you miserable atheist pain in the ass.
Yea, anything does go. Language has to be flexible to aid us in understanding and communicating in a complex and dynamic environment. Just as the inherent flexibility of our biology and culture has allowed us to adapt to various environments. I will offer this, you are correct that there are cultural norms for language use. These norms tend to be conservative overtime and function to maintain coherence over time. If language changed too rapidly various generations would not be able to communicate knowledge to each other. This is happening to some degree with text messaging. This may be to an extent what you are referring to. Culture will ultimately adapt however. But these expectations are still relative cultural constructs and not linguistic laws. The following is meant to offend you: You shit head! Nothing else contained in this comment was intended to offend you.
Here’s what’s not getting through: I do, in fact, believe language to be flexible.
You say, however, that “anything goes” and then acknowledge what I’ve been saying all along: “there are cultural norms for language use.” If there are cultural norms, then a violation of those norms is “incorrect language use.”
When does an error turn into a new “norm?” That’s hard to say, and is often arguable.
The fact of the EXISTENCE of grammar at all, by definition, assumes a set of rules - since grammar consists of the rules of construction, morphology and syntax applicable to language. You can call these rules “cultural norms” but that doesn’t change anything.
I’ve never said there was any such thing as a “linguistic law” (implying something unchanging).
I don’t think we’re far from agreement here. You just keep skipping over the parts in my posts where I explain that language usage, grammar, morphology, syntax, etc. all can and do change over time. That being said, if someone spells the word “cat” by typing “xpq” we can fairly say he’s “wrong” under the current “norms” of the English language. That’s what saying someone is using “incorrect grammar” is as well.
There is a lot of incorrect grammar seeping into the mainstream of the English language. One example that I notice quite a bit is the blurring of the distinction between “fewer” and “less.” Even among our television pundits and news anchors, the use of the word “less” in relation to things that can be counted (e.g. less cars on the road, or less people in the churches) is rampant. That usage is certainly wrong, and it would be ludicrous to say that it is simply a type of “suburban English” with which we are unfamiliar.
There are rules. That being said, rules change. Where the lines are drawn is simply a never ending debate. The rules of have changed before, and they will change again. However, the rules do seem to change from one fairly understandable structure to another fairly understandable structure.
That usage is wrong, until it’s not. Language has always functioned like this nothing has changed. There were people bitching about grammar centuries ago, and now we are using the language they resisted. Your position is a role of conservation in an environment of free progression.
this discussion seems familiar. language change etc.
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